Showing posts 1 - 10 of 11
  1. Samantha Fanning

    Management at Web

    07 November 2008 11:27am

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    Advice please! Our website is Double-A compliant. I've been told that the reason we can't use browser-based tracking is that the javascript involved in this would affect our compliance rating. Does anyone know if this is actually the case? I keep reading reports whereby site owners say X% have javascript disabled  - you can only know that if you measure it, right? So therefore the tags on those sites aren't interferring with those users whose browser settings are different? Does that mean all metrics tools are closed to me other than log file analysis? Are there are metrics packages out there that 'don't interfere with' accessibility compliance? Any information greatly appreciated...

  2. Denis Kondopoulos

    Technical Project Manager (MBA, MBCS, CITP, CEng) at Naxtech.com

    07 November 2008 13:06pm

    Denis Kondopoulos

    To quickly address your points:

    1. Javascript does not necessarily affect your compliance rating. It depends on the exact way it's implemented.  Wed have to examine the particular code to tell with certainty.

    2. Javascript-based web traffic tools are often not effective or not working if javascript is disabled., which may mean that your metrics will not reflect the truth. 

    Generally speaking there is no standard and agreed way of measuring things.  The various metrics software, either provided as a service or analysis tools for the web logs, each one have their own definitions of what is a visit or a unique visitor, etc.

    Based on what you mentioned, in my view you either need a metrics tool which provided both javascript and non-javascript metrics in one piece of code,  or a combination of online/javascript based tools and web log analysis tools.

    I hope this helps.

    regards,

    Denis
    www.naxtech.com

  3. Samantha Fanning

    Management at Web

    07 November 2008 14:02pm

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    Thanks for the response - my previous experience of users  who disable javascript is 2% or less - and that's averaged across a wide range of sites - transactional to entertainment. And on the basis that my log files are telling me so little, even data on 98% of my audience is better than nothing (and given all tools have some degree of "inaccuracy", it's about consistency in the inaccuracies :-)).

    My issue is whether our Double-A 'badge' would be removed if we had javascript on the pages which is what I was led to believe. I can't see any mention of it on their site.

    I am interested in what you say though about tools which offer both options in one piece of code? Is there more information on your site about this? Do you do post implementation reviews?

  4. dan barker

    E-Business Consultant at Dan Barker

    07 November 2008 15:16pm

    dan barker

    hi, Latchmere,

    Have a look at this:

    http://accessit.nda.ie/web-resources/guidance/guidance-v-wai-wcag-1-0-nda-guidelines

    Here are the javascript guidelines:

    • Do not rely on JavaScript alone for important content or functionality
    • JavaScript enabled content that requires use of the mouse must be accessible without the mouse
    • Do not rely solely on client side scripts for form validation, etc.
    • Avoid use of JavaScript links
    • Avoid automatic submission in forms elements

    The javascript used for analytics doesn't add any functionality, doesn't rely on the mouse, doesn't validate forms, doesn't alter link behaviour, doesn't submit forms.

    Therefore you should be totally fine to use it.

    daniel

  5. Denis Kondopoulos

    Technical Project Manager (MBA, MBCS, CITP, CEng) at Naxtech.com

    07 November 2008 15:24pm

    Denis Kondopoulos

    Hi again,

    Usually the accessibility level of a site is not affected by this sort of thing, but just to be on the safe side you could always to a little test/trial, incorporate the code in some sort of a test page and then check that page for accessibility issues.

    With regard to your questions:

    - I know some which do offer (or at least used to, last time i checked) but I would start the opposite way.  I'd start from the type of information you want to see, and what kind of functionality you want.  Maybe if you get in touch with me I can try and assist with making a selection?

    - Post implementation reviews is indeed something we can do if you wish.  But let's take a step at a time.  Might be better to talk offline in detail.

    regards,

    Denis
    www.naxtech.com

  6. Julie Sari

    Senior Account Manager at Nedstat

    10 November 2008 12:47pm

    Julie Sari

    Hi Latchmere. Have you considered Nedstat for your analytics? We track more than log files, we can report on javascript, IP and cookies all at once. We're also ABC Electronics certified which means our data is audited regularly and fully compliant.

    If you'd like more information or have any questions, feel free to get in touch.

    Hope this helps

    Julie

    On 11:27:35 7 November 2008 Latchmere wrote:

    Advice please! Our website is Double-A compliant. I've been told that the reason we can't use browser-based tracking is that the javascript involved in this would affect our compliance rating. Does anyone know if this is actually the case? I keep reading reports whereby site owners say X% have javascript disabled  - you can only know that if you measure it, right? So therefore the tags on those sites aren't interferring with those users whose browser settings are different? Does that mean all metrics tools are closed to me other than log file analysis? Are there are metrics packages out there that 'don't interfere with' accessibility compliance? Any information greatly appreciated...

  7. Nick Wilson

    director at virtual zone

    11 November 2008 14:22pm

    Nick Wilson

    Hi

    We use script for logging visits to our client's sites without affecting their WCAG AA+ compliance.

    We are also the UK Business Partner for HiSoftware and use their Compliance Sheriff to test websites and pages.  If you drop me an email I can comment in detail on your site and what tagging might do to it.

    All the best

    Nick

    www.thevirtualzone.co.uk

  8. Samantha Fanning

    Management at Web

    11 November 2008 14:34pm

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    The advice has all been extremely helpful, thank you. If I'm understanding it all correctly then having the metrics tool code on my pages won't cause my CMS AA compliance checker to read the page as a failure. Basically,  because the tags on the page are an interaction between the browser and the tool's server, not an interaction between my user and the browser (such as an 'onclick' instruction or something). I can live with not getting data on a tiny proportion of my audience with javascript disabled, that wouldn't be my deal breaker, I just didn't want to lose our AA rating (which would!).

    Thanks again for the help, I'll be following up on services research with some of you when it comes time to buy and implement a web metrics solution :-)

  9. Nick Wilson

    director at virtual zone

    11 November 2008 14:40pm

    Nick Wilson

    On 14:34:55 11 November 2008 Latchmere wrote:


    The advice has all been extremely helpful, thank you. If I'm understanding it all correctly then having the metrics tool code on my pages won't cause my CMS AA compliance checker to read the page as a failure. Basically,  because the tags on the page are an interaction between the browser and the tool's server, not an interaction between my user and the browser (such as an 'onclick' instruction or something). I can live with not getting data on a tiny proportion of my audience with javascript disabled, that wouldn't be my deal breaker, I just didn't want to lose our AA rating (which would!).

    Thanks again for the help, I'll be following up on services research with some of you when it comes time to buy and implement a web metrics solution :-)

  10. Nick Wilson

    director at virtual zone

    11 November 2008 14:43pm

    Nick Wilson

    Hi Latchmere.  Drop me an email when you've decided on your tagging solution and we will be pleased to confirm your accessibility rating for you.

    Regards

    Nick

    www.thevirtualzone.co.uk

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